Leader of The Nationals Matt Canavan - Sky News Interview
SKY NEWS TRANSCRIPT WITH HOST PETER STEFANOVIC; FUEL CRISIS; PAGE RESEARCH CENTRE REPORT ON LIQUID FUEL.
PETER STEFANVOIC
Joining us live is The Nationals leader, Matt Canavan. Matt, David Crisafulli, he wants to drill, baby, drill and open up the Taroom Trough, located off Queensland. So what are your thoughts on that? And further, should that lead to bans being lifted on oil exploration?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, Peter, I think almost everybody now can see that we need to drill. We need to, if we want to get our bills down, our petrol bills down, we've got to start drilling. And even a poll yesterday showed that 40 per cent of Greens voters want to drill, baby, drill. So, the question that's got to be asked here is what is the Labor Party waiting for? There's a massive majority of people who want to see this happen. Now, obviously, bringing online a new oil and gas basin will take a lot of time, but, the old proverb is true.
The best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago. The second-best time is today. So we need to get on with it. And today as well, the Page Research Centre, The Nationals Party thinktank, is releasing a major report on what we need to do if we have our oil supplies cut. This is work being done, been done over the last 12 months. It's very detailed. The, the fundamental finding of this report, Peter, is that we have enough energy in this country, in fact, on some measures, we are the second highest country in the world in energy per person terms, only after Saudi Arabia.
Our problem is an energy conversion problem. Most of that energy is in coal and gas, but you can convert that to liquid fuels, and this is one thing I don't think enough people are talking about, is that we should be looking at very, very strongly, bringing forward plans, for coal to liquids technology so that if the worst happens, or if this crisis continues, we can use our enormous coal reserves to keep our country moving.
PETER STEFANOVIC
Okay. Well, that would lead to environmental concerns and arguments against made by the Greens and Teals. So how would you battle against that?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, I think when people can't fill up their petrol tank, those luxury concerns start to dissipate. This is a choice between keeping people fed, keeping people in work, keeping our country alive. The problem, the fundamental problem I've had from the get-go with this whole net zero agenda is it subjugates really important things like our national security, our food security, below a global goal of net zero, which is not even being achieved around the world. And you can see that now, I think, in people's reaction, that there is a hierarchy of needs, that what is most important for any nation is to secure our own borders, defend our country, and of course, make sure everybody can be fed and housed, and we can keep our economy moving.
So any idea of net zero and that needs to be pushed down, the list of priorities right now, given the crisis we face.
PETER STEFANOVIC
Has this sort of stuff or approaches been made more difficult through the government's export finance changes?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, the government wants to today rush through legislation to seek to underwrite the importation of liquid fuels to our country. Now, I've had a briefing on this last night, and I spoke to my colleagues this morning. I'm sure the Liberal and National Parties will be constructive in our national interest, to help facilitate these changes. In saying that we do know what Labor did last summer. And last summer or last year, the Labor Party made a series of changes that made it harder for the government to back investment in liquid fuels.
And now they're scrambling around like a headless chook, trying to fix the mess of their own making.
As I say, we'll be constructive here, but we'll also, I think, try to be even more helpful than maybe they want. I think we should give the government the full power here to solve this liquid fuels crisis in any way they need. There should not be green handcuffs placed on a national government in any need to secure our national security, our oil security, our energy security, and our food security.
PETER STEFANOVIC
Yeah. Well, is there a bright light now on our onshore fuel problem in that China would so easily cut it off, our fuel supply that is, if it wanted to make a move on Taiwan down the track?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, this is a fundamental point, Peter, that this report makes today. This report, as I said, was done over the last 12 months. So it was precursed on the idea of a Pacific war, not a Middle East war, but similar consequences for us. And the point it makes is that, look, stockpiles are important, but that perhaps there's too much a focus on that because let's say we had three months rather than one month, well, plenty of sieges have lasted longer than three months. And now any adversary to our country, if we just had, if that's the only thing we had was three months of supply, they would just know that they just have to smoke us out for that time, and then we're in big, big trouble. The only real security for our nation could come if we can have domestic production, of our own liquid fuels. Keep in mind that 50 per cent, Peter, 50 per cent of our nation's imports by volume are liquid fuels.
And so this is the other problem, that right now a strategic vulnerability for our country is that we would need to defend those shipping lanes, those ships coming to our country.
And if we can replace those with liquid fuel production in our own country, that would massively reduce the naval task we would need in any conflict to defend 50 per cent of our nation's imports. I think this is an excellent piece of work. It's very timely, of course, quite coincidental. It's been worked on for the last 12 months.
But the Page Research Centre under Gerard Holland has been doing these long-term pieces for a while now. They just released one on family policy and the birth rate. They released a net zero one late last year showing how hopeless that idea was. And I'd encourage everyone to look at it. It's sobering reading.
PETER STEFANOVIC
Just finally, Matt, National Cabinet kicks off in a few hours' time. What do you hope emerges from that today?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, I think number one, some greater transparency. So the Queensland government's pushing for this, and the government last week finally started to provide daily updates on petrol stations that are out.
They seem to now have some information on that. I think we really need to go, you know, the full transparency we had at early COVID here though, and have proper transparency on how much fuel's being used each day, what industries, where the gaps are. And that will help inform both governments and the public of what we need to do. I do think there needs to be relief for Australian consumers.
Angus Taylor and I have announced that we should halve the fuel excise, and every day that the government refuses to do that, they're taking $16 million out of your pockets and sending it here to Canberra. And I just think that the Australian people need some breathing space here. It's very, very difficult at prices this high. And then finally coming back to where we've been talking on this show, we need a plan here to secure our liquid fuel security over the medium to long term. So put aside any ideology, put aside all of these net zero commitments, and just focus on what we need to do to keep our country moving.
PETER STEFANOVIC
And just finally, how would you feel about emergency plans at least being drawn up for fuel rationing?
MATT CANAVAN
Well, obviously the government says we have enough fuel now, so let's hope we don't need to go down that path. But look, it's always good to prepare for the worst and hope for the best. And so this will be very difficult. I mean, just to keep this in mind how important this is, Peter, and go back to the central point I'm making about the pre-eminence of liquid fuel security. At the height of COVID, the absolute height of the lockdowns, we reduced our oil demand by 20 per cent. That's all. That's it. All the work from home, all the stopping of flights, we reduced it by 20 per cent.
And so obviously an interruption that we're kind of talking about today that might arise during a major conflict could be many times worse than COVID, and, I think it is important for our governments to stress, how important fossil fuels are to our world. We've spent 10 years with childish playthings suggesting that hydrogen or batteries can replace liquid gold. Well, it can't. We're getting a real world lesson in the school of hard knocks showing that you need fossil fuels to keep a modern economy going.
We need fossil fuels to keep our country alive.
PETER STEFANOVIC
All right. That's Matt Canavan, The Nationals Leader with us this morning. Thank you, Matt.
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